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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/18/2003 Posts: 2,141 Location: Charlotte, North Carolina
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I am displaying a Cat 385C being hauled without being broken down. I think the real operating weight for the Cat is between 185,000 and 190,000 lbs. I can configure a truck and trailer, American style KW or Pete, as follows. A quad axle KW gives me three axles of carrying weight. Behind that, I can put a two axle jeep. That gives me 5 axles up front. I can then put a three axle lowboy with a fourth axle flip, or a stinger with one axle. That gives me a total of 9 axles. Figuring 20k lbs per axle, that's only 180k. If I change it around and do a 6x4 KW, a two axle jeep, followed by another two axle jeep, then the four axle in the rear, that gives me 6 axles up front, and four at the back. Now I have 10 axles or roughly 200k carrying capacity. This configuration is based on the available diecast trucks and trailers in the market. My question is #1 Is is feasible in real life to have a 6 and four combo to carry the 385c, or do you have to do an equal distribution of the weight over a balanced 5 and five axle spread? In other words, can you have two, two axle jeeps in a row? I don't know how to get 5 axles at the rear using any diecast trailer except the Corgi King 5 axle lowloader. I just want to know how to haul the CAT 385 whole using the mass produced toys available, no custom parts. Any of this make sense? CAW
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/1/2006 Posts: 2,487 Location: Buffalo, NY
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I could be wrong but I don't think in the US you can haul a 385 whole. Maybe out west/northwest you can but those are the crazy Cozad trailer setups that have tires throughout the entire trailer, what I mean by that is all across the axle.
Once again, I could be wrong.
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 2/20/2012 Posts: 557 Location: Lil north of pittsburgh.
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In Pa it's a no go that I am aware of too. Needs broken down here as well.
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 10/31/2011 Posts: 1,079 Location: Springfield, Oregon
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kokosing Const Co wrote:I could be wrong but I don't think in the US you can haul a 385 whole. Maybe out west/northwest you can but those are the crazy Cozad trailer setups that have tires throughout the entire trailer, what I mean by that is all across the axle.
Once again, I could be wrong. Only way I've seen them moved here is without the stick/bucket and counterweight on 12 or 13 axle strings.
-Jason YouTubeTimberline Thinning CompanyMy Photostream
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 12/16/2009 Posts: 607 Location: Surprise, AZ
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kokosing Const Co wrote:I could be wrong but I don't think in the US you can haul a 385 whole. Maybe out west/northwest you can but those are the crazy Cozad trailer setups that have tires throughout the entire trailer, what I mean by that is all across the axle.
Once again, I could be wrong. As far as I know, transporting a whole 385 is not legal here either (even with our "crazy cozad trailers" ) Anyway, I took a look in my folder of arizona heavy haulage photos (none of which are mine, unfortunately) and found these photos of some pretty big hoes being moved. Pretty low quality, but looks like a whole cat 245 The info attached to this photo says that this is the undercarriage of a mining excavator. I think this is a hitachi EX1800. Taken pretty well apart, but count the axle lines. Old komatsu pc1100, sans counterweight and stick EX800, same-ish weight to a 385, complete. Ex1200, no boom or counterweight 390DL, No counterweight or stick And just for good measure, a bonus photo of a cat d11t being moved by PHH's custom dolly's and beam trailer. So, to answer your question CAW, I'm pretty sure your display wont work. One thing I did notice was that you didn't account for the weight of the truck or trailer. Hope you enjoy the photos.
-Adam
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/18/2003 Posts: 2,141 Location: Charlotte, North Carolina
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Thanks guys. Adam, you are dead on. I forgot about the weight of the truck and trailer. Also, I was trying to be lazy and not break down the 385. Since I don't do custom work, I'll just display it for fun. Some guy has a 1:64 scale custom 250 ton trailer on Ebay right now. It looks great. Thanks again, especially, CATD11T for those pictures. PPH uses Murray trailelrs don't they? You guys know your stuff. CAW
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/29/2014 Posts: 231 Location: VA
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The standard operating weight for a 385C is 187360 pounds, it really wouldn't take much to remove the stick/bucket. Although i wouldn't have the heart to do that on a CCM piece!
Patrick
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/18/2003 Posts: 2,141 Location: Charlotte, North Carolina
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Patrick: Me either. I am referring to my 1/64th display using DCP truck and trailers and a 1/64 Norscot CAT 385C. I wouldn't wreck my CCM piece either. It's funny how 1/64 has so many more trucks and trailers than 1/50. It's a cool scale, just a little too pricey for the size. But they have jeeps, flips, and stingers.. I have 1/25 and 1/28th too. If it looks good, Ill buy it. But without question, 1/50 % 1/48 are the best. Thanks again. CAW
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/3/2003 Posts: 2,085 Location: Rockford,IL.
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Craig. You would need 19 axles to move it. The closest you will come is Swords Nelson 3+3+3 which is good for about 170-175,000 lbs. Ken
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 6/18/2003 Posts: 2,141 Location: Charlotte, North Carolina
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Ken: Plus the the trucks 3 axles? hat makes twelve. How do you get up to 19. Hoqw many do you need with stick and bucket off? Craig
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/29/2014 Posts: 231 Location: VA
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After taking the weight of the general purpose stick and the heaviest standard bucket in the Caterpillar spec sheet, i can tell you that without the stick and bucket, the machine would weigh in at 168,251 pounds woth the counterweight still attached. I'm not sure how Ken came up with how many axles you would need, but if we figure 20K pounds per axle, you would need 9 to move it. That would only account for the trailer axles, and not the truck! Hope that helps abit. If you did want to display it broken down, all you would need to do is drill out the two pins that hold the stick to the boom, and the cylinder above it.
Patrick
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 2/23/2011 Posts: 465 Location: Northern AZ
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In az you can haul them on a 9 axle...but stick has to come off for height. Or at least unpin the cylinder so the stick can lay down. Ant when I say 9 axle I mean the murray/ cozad triple 16s.
HAMMER TO FIT...PAINT TO MATCH!
The ironic use of IT IV emissions technology on forestry equipment…. “Burning the woods down while trying to save the ozone”
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 2/8/2006 Posts: 2,612 Location: Iowa
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CAW. THAT would give the DOT boys a heart attack.:d/
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/14/2009 Posts: 764 Location: michigan
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In Michigan you can move anything..... At night
Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 4/3/2003 Posts: 2,085 Location: Rockford,IL.
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Patrick C wrote:After taking the weight of the general purpose stick and the heaviest standard bucket in the Caterpillar spec sheet, i can tell you that without the stick and bucket, the machine would weigh in at 168,251 pounds woth the counterweight still attached. I'm not sure how Ken came up with how many axles you would need, but if we figure 20K pounds per axle, you would need 9 to move it. That would only account for the trailer axles, and not the truck! Hope that helps abit. If you did want to display it broken down, all you would need to do is drill out the two pins that hold the stick to the boom, and the cylinder above it. You have to include the empty weight of the tractor trailer. 170,000 plus 85,000 empty weight - 255,000. With 15000 on the steer, and 20k on the rest, 13 axles. That being said, you would have to load it perfect to the pound as you have no wiggle room. But, for the model world, the Nelson set up would be as close as you could get. Ken
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 7/13/2007 Posts: 269 Location: In Debt
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Quinella wrote:In other words, can you have two, two axle jeeps in a row? I don't know how to get 5 axles at the rear using any diecast trailer except the Corgi King 5 axle lowloader. I just want to know how to haul the CAT 385 whole using the mass produced toys available, no custom parts. Any of this make sense? CAW If you're interested, PM me your email and I can send you some pictures of CAT 385's and DEERE/HITACHI 850's being hauled complete using both single and dual jeeps. This is standard practice in Alberta, Canada along with CAT D10's and 657 scrapers all being hauled legally without being stripped down. Contractors like Sureway, Kidco, Whissell and Borger do it daily.
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 1/7/2014 Posts: 213 Location: Arizona
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Interesting conversation. I have been wondering how much of a load I could put on my models and keep them prototypical. Last week a lowboy showed up a work with a huge forklift, so I asked the driver and he told me that I could load up to 16k per axle. And that seems to be in line with what is being said hear.
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Rank: Member Groups: Member
Joined: 12/15/2008 Posts: 71 Location: Toronto, Canada
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My understanding is that the weight limits aren't as strict on dioramas and display shelves and that you are unlikely to get inspected by the local Department of Transport. I would say that close is close enough and that looking cool is the main factor.
Doug A
Operating heavy equipment since age 12. (Good thing I wasn't caught)
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 9/13/2006 Posts: 2,508 Location: PA
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When the company I work for had their 385 b LME, with the counterweight, boom, stick, bucket, catwalks off, and an empty fuel tank it still took a 4 axle truck pulling a 2x2x2 to haul it legally here in PA. They are a heavy mofo, but in a cabinet, it's really up to you.
regards, Jim
"Once again, concussion by safety" -Mike Rowe
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Rank: Advanced Member Groups: Member
Joined: 8/9/2002 Posts: 996 Location: worthington, ohio
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Something to keep in mind esp. with A Smith lowboy trailers is they will bow if the weight is left on them without support under the load section. I have several that have very visible bow. I have not noticed this on other model makers trailer.
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