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It doesn't look right though does it.Will Liebherr let them away with that,cause as some of you say a lot of the bits look the same. jim
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Jim fae Aberdeen wrote:It doesn't look right though does it.Will Liebherr let them away with that,cause as some of you say a lot of the bits look the same. jim I would say that everything is the same except for the cab and the quality of the crane in general.
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TimT wrote:Not Smart Enough???.... OK. I disagree. I think the dumb ones are right here in the gool ol USA. As we sit watching the Chinese build and grow by any means nessesary, we fall backwards like a house of cards. And copying ideas is what many of the machines that became MASS Produced in the USA were based on..... Western European engineering and development.... can we say Automobile?, Hyd Excavator? What country was Henry Harnischfeger or Alonzo Pawling born in?? and the list goes on and on forever. I can tell you this... One thing the Chinese are not.. is stupid or lazy. They are building some state of the art things in the heavy shipbuilding and offshore industry, and the mining business is likely to far surpass anything we have seen for decades. Ask the Aussies if the Chinese are good customers... "they own some of the biggest mines in that country by the way".... they are eating iron ore as fast as the Aussies can mine it,coal also.... You can add the Koreans to that list also.
Right now the Chinese are driving the demand for all the wonderful machines we like so much, not the USA, or Europe, no sir. Ask Liebherr or Terex who is buying thousand tonners and bigger, Ask Mammoet what the market for huge lifts and moves is in China, they will be happy to tell you. Who bought the second CC 8800 Twin....AND put it to work as a twin. Ask Lampson who just bought he biggest Transi-Lift ever made.... and guess what, the Chinese will be building them bigger and better in very short order ..copy or not... Lots of folks here in the USA need to wake up.
while im not disagreeing with you about the Chinese doing major things in their country its just kind of low that they couldnt even come up with their own design. i have been saying for years and years that the Chinese are going to pass up the US and they will be the next super power. US is gonna be falling 2nd in line to the Chinese very soon! Tim is right, they are doing everything in bulk and he is right about the large cranes too. as far as i know China is probably one of the only countries that is not on the downswing right now like this crap hole we are living in right now! Kudos to the Chinese for becoming the next major super power, but shame for not coming up with their own design and idea
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like i said earlier why would you go through the years and years and years of trial and error in design and pump 10's if not 100's of millions into R&D and testing when you can buy a crane from Liebherr for maybe 5/6million and just copy it,liebherr have gone and done all the hard work for you. its in the legalilties is where the trouble could be,I would seriously doubt Liebherr has anything to do with this at all,but you'll find there are legal loop holes for this to be perfectly ok, i think the only think copyrighted would be the name and model number and any technology Liebherr pioneered and incorporated into the crane they will have patents for,but possibly no granted patents for asia,so for example if the 11200 has patents to safe guard its technology in the US,Europe,Africa and Australia and not in China,this would allow Sany to copy the machine but only be safe to sell it in china if however it is made under licence by liebherr then it will be a complete carbon copy of a 11200 and there will be no issue whatsoever with build quality,as liebherr couldn't put their name to a sub standard product but my guess would be my first point now the bigger question,whos gonna be the first to have a go at customising a 11200 in the livery of Sany? 
Why is "phonetically" spelt with a "ph"? ... It's better to be silent and thought a fool, then to speak up and remove all doubt The complex of Newgrange was originally built between c. 3100 and 2900 BC,[2] meaning that it's aproximately 5,000 years old. According to Carbon-14 dates,[3] it is more than 500 years older than the Great Pyramid of Giza in Egypt, and predates Stonehenge by about 1,000 years.
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im not saying i dont understand what you are saying Graham.... but for the simple fact of people damn well know its a Liebherr, reputation, you want to be known as the copy cat? obviously Sany doesnt care about that sort of repuation but to some it makes you look like a jerk. now its possible that Liebherr had a hard time with a patent in Asia and China..... i know my dad has a patent on something he invented and he only has Patents for Europe, Australia, US, Canada but said it was VERY VERY expensive to get a patent in Asia and China so it wasnt worth it to him, i find it hard to believe though that a company like Liebherr would have a hard time coming up with the cash to pay for said patents.... Liebherr could be in on it and just raking in the dough, i have no idea.... but to me personally i think it makes Sany look like they just copied an already existing and successful crane. kudos to them if they got away with it but like i said, just makes you look like a copy cat you wanna see a Sany repaint buddy? ill give you one if i come in contact with an extra 11200 
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haha thankfully i don't have a plain liveried one floating about lol a Sany would be a unique livery though lol
I know where you're coming from totally,to us fans and collectors it seems a sly move but coming at it from a chinese crane hire business's perspective,i wouldn't care if it looks like a giant ham cheese sandwich,if it can lift X amount and make me money then gimme gimmer gimme
who was it that copied the the P&H or Bucyrus cable shovel a while back too
Why is "phonetically" spelt with a "ph"?
... It's better to be silent and thought a fool, then to speak up and remove all doubt
The complex of Newgrange was originally built between c. 3100 and 2900 BC,[2] meaning that it's aproximately 5,000 years old. According to Carbon-14 dates,[3] it is more than 500 years older than the Great Pyramid of Giza in Egypt, and predates Stonehenge by about 1,000 years.
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My rant was not directed at anyone just to set it straight. The thing that bothers me is the way things are heading in our own country. Its gone completely out of control, all the regulation, and government takeovers... The government has NEVER been good at running ANYTHING that belongs in private hands. The only thing that comes to mind is the militray and maybe the BuRec.
China, Korea, India, and others grow and develop while we wallow around like idiots... or the politicians do anyway... "but we let them." I don't like the idea that the Chinese and others copy good machines, but thats how it starts....and who can blame them?? They want to get the jobs done. Then they get good at building bigger and better things and the quality gets better and better... and in the end... we become a third world country and shake our heads and wonder why..... To watch this happen, and know the basic reasons why its happening and not be able to do anything about is very upsetting. Thankfully we have elections here... "unless the government trys to change that also".. and maybe we can get going again, but I realy have my doudts.
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Went through this very argument last week ..Tim. It is not about disliking the USA etc...we Aussies are your mates plain and simple. The bottom line to it is the USA has to get rid of the mindset that some of these countries are 3rd world and backwards. Then the USA has to get off their ass and start competing with superior equipment like they used to...can't see it happening though. They have tried to buy our mines but have been blocked by Govt legislation. They are also in the process of trying to buy our sugar companies but are also being blocked by legislation.
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tim your spot on again, what a pile of B.S. a couple of nice crane pics can start
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sany is not the only company that seems to so call "copy" Liebherr design.. check out Zoomlion.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HgAcrLIEJE&feature=relatedttp://4.bp.blogspot.com/_kr5IYZCeSAA/SuhMsnJDQyI/AAAAAAAAABY/NURne3aAMSs/s1600/Zoom_Crawler.jpg does this looks familiar to the crane guys?? if u remember bauma china another company has a similar design of a 500ton to a liebherr.. 
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d3an_cain wrote:sany is not the only company that seems to so call "copy" Liebherr design.. check out Zoomlion.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HgAcrLIEJE&feature=relatedttp://4.bp.blogspot.com/_kr5IYZCeSAA/SuhMsnJDQyI/AAAAAAAAABY/NURne3aAMSs/s1600/Zoom_Crawler.jpg does this looks familiar to the crane guys?? if u remember bauma china another company has a similar design of a 500ton to a liebherr.. A working link to the picture: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_kr5IYZCeSAA/SuhMsnJDQyI/AAAAAAAAABY/NURne3aAMSs/s1600/Zoom_Crawler.jpg^copy of LR 11350  And about LTM 1500, yes that sucks!
//Alexander
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Other examples of copies...  The Russian Ural is a maintenance intensive copy of a BMW.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Elis-Hobby-Diecast/803248369690387?ref=hl
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Not only the crane is a copy of LTM 11200, also the cab reminds me a lot about Scania cabs. I have heard that Liebherr sell their drawings to Sany, so that's probably why Liebherr don't care if they use a similar design. But except all this, it actually looks pretty good thanks for the pics!
//Alexander
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A I Nikolis wrote:Not only the crane is a copy of LTM 11200, also the cab reminds me a lot about Scania cabs. I have heard that Liebherr sell their drawings to Sany, so that's probably why Liebherr don't care if they use a similar design. But except all this, it actually looks pretty good thanks for the pics! It almost 100% is a scania cab, it looks like one of the municipul like, like Dustbin wagons, Airport trucks
Heavy Cranes
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Here's an amusing thought .. What if SANY is Liebherr's second line ? Its one thing to sit in a court and argue..its another to take a potential counterfitter aside..and you know what .. a deal can be struck thats mutually benificial .. "my enemy is my friend " To me sitting here ..The timing and resemblance with no real public move on Liebherr's part ..just seems to much to think this is a copy...theres more to it ..
Q-Ball a wolf in Jesus skin ---the sorcerer of reasonable commentary  I smile & wave Sometimes I think life is just a rodeo,
The trick is to ride and make it to the bell.
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Lotsacrane wrote:Here's an amusing thought ..
What if SANY is Liebherr's second line ?  SANY definitely has links to original manufacturers, they have produced Komatsu based excavators for a long time now. Photos: Brian Carlisle   Rowan.
1:25th scale CAT 375L excavator
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PPS. This picture is from early Nov last year, lets not forget what other machines (original and replicated) they have built that are similar... in design.... Photos: Brian Carlisle  Rowan.
1:25th scale CAT 375L excavator
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TimT wrote:My rant was not directed at anyone just to set it straight. The thing that bothers me is the way things are heading in our own country. Its gone completely out of control, all the regulation, and government takeovers... The government has NEVER been good at running ANYTHING that belongs in private hands. The only thing that comes to mind is the militray and maybe the BuRec.
China, Korea, India, and others grow and develop while we wallow around like idiots... or the politicians do anyway... "but we let them." I don't like the idea that the Chinese and others copy good machines, but thats how it starts....and who can blame them?? They want to get the jobs done. Then they get good at building bigger and better things and the quality gets better and better... and in the end... we become a third world country and shake our heads and wonder why..... To watch this happen, and know the basic reasons why its happening and not be able to do anything about is very upsetting. Thankfully we have elections here... "unless the government trys to change that also".. and maybe we can get going again, but I realy have my doudts. You are right Tim! America needs to take care of America first, until we are of that mindset, nothing will change. As for the general issue, the Chinese (government) dosen't give a good damn about human rights, so to think they would care about all the things they copy would be rediculous. I will give them credit, while alot of other countries, the US especially, worries about nothing but nonsense, they take care of their country first. If we learn nothing else from them, that should be enough. Mark
Mark L. It's what you learn after you know it all that counts
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